Way back in the 1980's a man had a vision. A television show set in a Science Fiction universe that had real characters, real problems and limited technology to solve those problems. More imporntantly his story was five years long. Long before the first episode ever began shooting, he had written a series bible that tied everything and everyone together. That man was J. Michael Strazynski and that show was Babylon 5.
He was told, it wouldn't work. The only SciFi on TV was Star Trek. And no one was going to tune in every week to catch a "chapter" of a 5 year TV/book. Finally, after years of hearing "No" he got his chance, on a network called PTen. Pten collapsed and was bought out by the TNT network. That is when the meddling began. They didn't like his star, so they got him replaced, they wanted a "fighter ace" so we got one, for one season, which is when JMS killed him off. The Network continued to stick their hand in the pot and stir it around a bit, changing the airtime until eventually even the die hard fans didn't know when it was on.
The resulting ratings dip almost got the show shortened by a whole season. So much so, that he filmed the final episode and tied up the major story arcs in the 4th season. When season 5 finally did get greenlit, the quality suffored a bit because of the tie up at the end of season 4.
However, it endured. Later on writers like Joss Wheadon would mention Babylon 5 over Trek as an inspiration to his show Firefly, also serialized Science Fiction. Even later than that, new television shows like 24, Lost and Heroes brought serialized television to the forefront of the market. Fans not only were willing to follow chapter style story telling, they preferred it.
In between the end of Babylon 5 and the start of 24 though, a shift occurred in the television market. The "reality tv show", which is not really reality at all, but it is something else, cheaper than dirt to produce. Why pay big name actors to star in 22 episode seasons when you can pull schmucks off the street and have them compete against each other for less than the cost of a single actor from an episode of Friends. The "reality" shows pulled just as many, if not more viewers than their dramatic counterparts, but cost no where near the amount of money. The ratings allow them to charge more for the advertising, and thus, more profit is generated for the Network.
No where is this more evident than in two popular television shows this season. CBS's Jericho and NBC's Heroes. Jericho was up against ratings giant American Idol for much of its run, yet it was able to hold on to decent ratings. But CBS was not looking for decent ratings, they wanted something to take the top spot in its timeslot, so the axe came out at the end of season one. A good show, with lots of fans, was cancelled because it couldnt top American Idol, a show that costs about 80/night in alcohol for Paula Abdul to make.
Then comes Heroes. Probably the single most talked about new show on television this season, yet it barely survived being cancelled because the ratings were only "good" not super spectacular.
In the world of broadcast network television, there is a very fine line between ratings and profit. You can have good ratings, but low profit and be on the canned list. Networks don't care about producing good television they care about producing profitable television. If CBS can put a show that pulls the same ratings at twice the profit of Jericho, then it just might get renewed.
Which finally brings me to Star Trek Reborn. The world of Star Trek has been stagnant for a long time now. With lackluster motion pictures and horrendous television production, its fan base has dwindled. It has taken the average fan to bring in a truly fresh perspective on a once great television phenomenon. Reborn captures the simple elegance of Classic Star Trek while bringing in a modern day twist in dramatic serialized story telling. It gives Star Trek the face lift it so desperately needed. And while we are all hoping that some of the elements of Reborn make it into the JJ Abrahms feature, it will likely never make it on the small screen. Already networks are turning down more and more serialized drama on television instead asking for more cheap thrills.
Smart TV is a thing of the past, expect your boob toob to be just that. Mindless Televsion for the mindless America who can't wait to see who the next 10 minute Idol will be, or who can dance the tango the best.
Perhaps another medium could make Reborn into reality. Cable Networks seem to be ones taking more chances in television production these days. Even internet broadcasts could be a future medium that tries to break new ground, but the days of edgy broadcast network television have officially gone the way of the dinosaur.
That was insightful and prolific... and most likely dead on.
I've long said that ST(R) is just begging to be Produced. But you're right, the broadcast networks would never touch it (thank GOD, actually); -if- reborn was to be picked up, it would be by a cable network like SciFi. I suppose a wet dream of some of us would be for RDM to take an interest in it and run it by TPTB @ SciFi. It has a similar -dare I say it- edginess that RDM put into BSG....
I've also thought that an alternative would be to storyboard ST(R). With a talented artist that could take direction from Ro'Jer, having storyboards to compliment/augment the existing stories would be a unique departure from classic storytelling, while also playing into the already visual style of Ro'Jer's narrative. There were hints of this in the comic book approach, but for various reasons it didn't continue.
Either way, ST(R) is truly solid Trek. I'm glad it's around.
------- THAT is the Exploration that awaits you: not mapping stars or studying nebulae, but charting the unknown possibilities of Existence.
Damn, Spirit...I'm speechless. Thank you so much. I know that sounds weird; saying 'thank you' for your essentially saying "Your show could never make it on network television", but I take that as a compliment being that I agree with your thesis completely.
Network TV is just...dont even get me started. If there ever was a harbinger for the end times, fucking Fear Factor had to be it. "Come one and all and watch people humiliate and degrade themselves on national television". The show makes me sick (and not for the school-yard "I dare you to eat this" mentality of all the disgusting things the 'contestants' are doing), but for what it says about the people that enjoy watching it. I compare it to the Romans watching their captives thrown to the lions. It's our version of it; it proves that the age of enlightenment just might really be over.
However, sure, if some guy was irresponsible enough to give me a cable or web-based show to run, I'd be a crazy not to take it.
I think that one day the internet is going to phase out what we think of as cable and network television anyway. I'm not saying we're not going to have TVs in every living room--Americans love them just as much as they love their damn cars--but I think the notions we have of 'television channels' simply wont be the same. People are going to be watching programs but the options will be endless. Ratings will be irrelevant because there wont be those handfull of shows that just about everybody watches; the spectrum will be too broad for that.
If technology keeps progressing (and there's no reason to think it wont) and we can keep the web independant and out of the control of the corporate quinopoly (like they run every other medium of media), we'll see a real golden age of audio/visual art. It'll be like the 70s (an era of film-making that I regard as very signifigant); imagine all the Scorsesees, De Palmas, Altmans, Friedkins, Coppolas et al just waiting to be discovered out there.
The autumn days swung soft around me, like cotton on my
skin. But as the embers of the summer lost their breath
and disappeared, my heart went cold, and only hollow
rhythms resounded from within.
NX-47 wrote:
That was insightful and prolific... and most likely dead on.
I've long said that ST(R) is just begging to be Produced. But you're right, the broadcast networks would never touch it (thank GOD, actually); -if- reborn was to be picked up, it would be by a cable network like SciFi. I suppose a wet dream of some of us would be for RDM to take an interest in it and run it by TPTB @ SciFi. It has a similar -dare I say it- edginess that RDM put into BSG....
LOL! How dare you?!
Yeah, I'll take edgy. Just not 'dark'.
I've also thought that an alternative would be to storyboard ST(R). With a talented artist that could take direction from Ro'Jer, having storyboards to compliment/augment the existing stories would be a unique departure from classic storytelling, while also playing into the already visual style of Ro'Jer's narrative.
Ben's beauiful work was never really intended as an ongoing project, just as a couple one-offs done at his leisure. But there has been rumblings of such a thing before, yes. In fact, several different folks have offered to do just what you're suggesting...but then I never heard from them again. While I love the idea, I just dont think most people really have the motivation to do it. And I dont blame them. It's a lot of work with no reimbursment.
Although, I suppose I could pay somebody. Hmmm...
Either way, ST(R) is truly solid Trek. I'm glad it's around.
My thanx, as always, Dale.
The autumn days swung soft around me, like cotton on my
skin. But as the embers of the summer lost their breath
and disappeared, my heart went cold, and only hollow
rhythms resounded from within.
Thanks guys. I'm glad you guys agreed with it. I was a little upset when I wrote it (long day, poor hotel internet, shitty stuff on tv), but I just felt like as good as what STR is, no network would ever touch it, it would too risky for their profit run lives. Too bad though, I bet it would rekindle the Star Trek Flame.
ST(R) is the Star Trek that I have been wanting for years and years and years - it would definetely rekindle the Star Trek flame. It is exactly what I think that Star Trek should be like, and I love how serious and meaningful it is - It makes me damn proud to be a Star Trek fan
The autumn days swung soft around me, like cotton on my
skin. But as the embers of the summer lost their breath
and disappeared, my heart went cold, and only hollow
rhythms resounded from within.
SpiritOne wrote:In the world of broadcast network television, there is a very fine line between ratings and profit. You can have good ratings, but low profit and be on the canned list. Networks don't care about producing good television they care about producing profitable television. If CBS can put a show that pulls the same ratings at twice the profit of Jericho, then it just might get renewed.
Agreed. Unfortunately, that is currently how it is with regular network tv.
SpiritOne wrote:Which finally brings me to Star Trek Reborn. The world of Star Trek has been stagnant for a long time now. With lackluster motion pictures and horrendous television production, its fan base has dwindled. It has taken the average fan to bring in a truly fresh perspective on a once great television phenomenon. Reborn captures the simple elegance of Classic Star Trek while bringing in a modern day twist in dramatic serialized story telling. It gives Star Trek the face lift it so desperately needed.
Amen! Even though I've read only the first several episodes, I'm already impressed with ST:R. It has balls the size of basketballs and takes no prisoners, much akin to RDM's Galactica, but it also has the optimism that ST is renowned for, creating a more balanced viewpoint, unlike RDM's Galactica where it only depicts the negative aspects of humanity.
SpiritOne wrote:And while we are all hoping that some of the elements of Reborn make it into the JJ Abrahms feature, it will likely never make it on the small screen. Already networks are turning down more and more serialized drama on television instead asking for more cheap thrills.
Yes, most of the shows on regular network tv are crap, which in a way is a sort of a good thing when you really think about it because if all of the shows were great, then we'd all end up as cough potatoes!
SpiritOne wrote:Smart TV is a thing of the past, expect your boob toob to be just that. Mindless Televsion for the mindless America who can't wait to see who the next 10 minute Idol will be, or who can dance the tango the best.
It really pisses me off that that is what the general public wants to see nowadays. Now, I don't know if this is because I live in Florida or what, but till today, I still see every year tv commercials advertising the birthday of Mickey Mouse, pestering people with their families to go off to Walt Disney World and celebrate his "birthday". Are you kidding me?!? Gee, it's no wonder that nobody takes this country of ours seriously anymore. The regular networks waste way too much time informing the public the birthday of an imaginary rodent!!!!
Jeremy wrote:Network TV is just...dont even get me started. If there ever was a harbinger for the end times, fucking Fear Factor had to be it. "Come one and all and watch people humiliate and degrade themselves on national television". The show makes me sick (and not for the school-yard "I dare you to eat this" mentality of all the disgusting things the 'contestants' are doing), but for what it says about the people that enjoy watching it. I compare it to the Romans watching their captives thrown to the lions. It's our version of it; it proves that the age of enlightenment just might really be over.
Well said, Jeremy! I applaud you. Personally, I can't stand reality-tv. Even the very words, "reality-tv" makes me want to puke. These reality-tv shows are a piece of shit that deserves to be flush down the toliet, pronto.
SpiritOne wrote:Perhaps another medium could make Reborn into reality. Cable Networks seem to be ones taking more chances in television production these days. Even internet broadcasts could be a future medium that tries to break new ground, but the days of edgy broadcast network television have officially gone the way of the dinosaur.
It's quite true that edgy tv is no longer the fad. But as you stated, cable tv networks certainly has been more open to such ideas. If you had a tv show to sell, most likely you'll have a better chance with them, particularly with such popular cable networks such as HBO, Showtime, and Cinemax to name a few. Heck, even the Independent Channel wouldn't be a bad idea either. But in addition, I think there are also other alternatives such as web-based series and the recently popular direct-to-DVD release.
Jeremy wrote:I think that one day the internet is going to phase out what we think of as cable and network television anyway. I'm not saying we're not going to have TVs in every living room--Americans love them just as much as they love their damn cars--but I think the notions we have of 'television channels' simply wont be the same. People are going to be watching programs but the options will be endless. Ratings will be irrelevant because there wont be those handfull of shows that just about everybody watches; the spectrum will be too broad for that.
If technology keeps progressing (and there's no reason to think it wont) and we can keep the web independant and out of the control of the corporate quinopoly (like they run every other medium of media), we'll see a real golden age of audio/visual art. It'll be like the 70s (an era of film-making that I regard as very signifigant); imagine all the Scorsesees, De Palmas, Altmans, Friedkins, Coppolas et al just waiting to be discovered out there.
There is no doubt in my mind that web-based series, as well as direct-to-DVD release are the wave of the future. One major advantage that these mediums have over regular network tv is that there is no network interference, thus, allowing the creator/s of the show fully realize their vision as the way they originally intended it to be. There are already quite a few web-based shows and direct-to-DVD release projects that may actually be far more profitable as well. It's simply a matter of time, but it will eventually become more common. Just wait and see. It's gonna be fuckin' great.
I can only agree with everything that was said here, as I'm not only sharing the viewpoint, but I'm also too tired and lazy to elaborate on the subject.
I can also tell that the pasture isn't greener up north, even in Quebec, where we pride ourselves with our independant culture and medias, we get invaded by our own reality shows and ripoffs (we have versions of Deal or No Deal, Big Brother, Idol, etc) and media conglomerates have a bigger and bigger control over medias, including the web, as all major internet providers in Canada own major TV stations, newspapers, magazines and all that shit...
We are curently living the golden age of the internet, and hopefully, we can keep it relatively independant and "neutral" as long as possible.
And Jer, Star Trek Reborn totally desserves to be on some cable networks, the new vanguard of quality TV. If we can bring only a fraction of its goodness to Krossroads, I'll be happy. Hopefully, it'll be worthy of the Reborn franchise!
Oh and Whitestar, I'm hoping to read more posts from you!
Tupperfan wrote:
I can only agree with everything that was said here, as I'm not only sharing the viewpoint, but I'm also too tired and lazy to elaborate on the subject.
I can also tell that the pasture isn't greener up north, even in Quebec, where we pride ourselves with our independant culture and medias, we get invaded by our own reality shows and ripoffs (we have versions of Deal or No Deal, Big Brother, Idol, etc) and media conglomerates have a bigger and bigger control over medias, including the web, as all major internet providers in Canada own major TV stations, newspapers, magazines and all that shit...
Really? I was under the impression that things were more independent in Canada. By the way, I love Canada and I'm even considering moving there someday. I especially enjoy their animation, it's one of the best I've ever seen.
Tupperfan wrote:We are curently living the golden age of the internet, and hopefully, we can keep it relatively independant and "neutral" as long as possible.
I think it should remain independent indefinitely.
Tupperfan wrote:And Jer, Star Trek Reborn totally desserves to be on some cable networks, the new vanguard of quality TV. If we can bring only a fraction of its goodness to Krossroads, I'll be happy. Hopefully, it'll be worthy of the Reborn franchise!
Agreed!
Tupperfan wrote:Oh and Whitestar, I'm hoping to read more posts from you!
Why do I feel like standing on the hood of a truck with an AK-47, leading (or at least covering the guys walking in front who are actually leading) the revolution? I felt that way a few days ago blaring the Fixx into my "oh my god how the fuck did i live without these" noise-canceling headphones while on a cattle-car-esqe jetliner?
Who wants to start a pirate broadcast radio station dedicated to the music of the revolution (and not that commie shit )? Sim, Rich...you guys are lucky, anyone wanting to hit the whole fucking country with pirate radio can find a rusted-out, wing-and-a-prayer-from-sinking lightship with a radio tower and hit everyone with the sounds of reality.
Up there we were heroes, fighting robot bitches...
Priest: Great wall of prophecy, reveal to us God?’s will that we may blindly obey.
Crowd: Free us from thought and responsibility.
Priest: Your words guide us.
Crowd: We are dumb.
Jeremy 01/01/2025 06:11:30 Your welcome, Moe. You read it already?
Jeremy 01/01/2025 06:10:13 Hey...now I dont feel so bad about being home tonight. Seems everyone else is too. Although, in my defense, I'm sick with a cold and broke as hell.
Moeskido 01/01/2025 05:06:19 Happy New Year, folks. Thanks for 109, Mr. Ro.
Jeremy 01/01/2025 04:19:13 1.09 - 'That Mine Own Tears Do Scald' is up in Season 1.
Forsythe-1 01/01/2025 04:04:34 Slainte Mhath all! Happy New year. Be safe but sobriety optional!
Tober138 01/01/2025 00:42:13 HAPPY NEW YEAR! Here's hoping 2025 is better than the previous year for everyone!! Slainte!!!
Jeremy 12/31/2007 21:14:44 Jack's back in the Mill with a rant about...well, just read it.
Sim 12/31/2007 10:45:02 Absinthe! Nice ... but some brands are really unenjoyable. Never managed to get an opium solution to prepare the proper cocktain, though ...
Sam Cogley 12/31/2007 03:34:19 Y'all had better enjoy NYE, since I can't...
Tober138 12/31/2007 00:46:08 Mmmm...absinthe...had some the other night...prepared properly too
More 
)? Sim, Rich...you guys are lucky, anyone wanting to hit the whole fucking country with pirate radio can find a rusted-out, wing-and-a-prayer-from-sinking lightship with a radio tower and hit everyone with the sounds of reality.
Guests Online: 1
v6.00.307 ? 2003-2025